I got the shock of my life the other morning when in town. I was passing Piper's Hill when I noticed the sign had been changed to Market Lane.

I'm concerned that Piper's Hill has been banished without a word. Some nameless outsider in the council has probably decided that the new name is more appropriate. However, there was town history in the name Piper's Hill. Nearly everyone knew the story behind the name, whether true or not. I'm sure the original people of Lisburn, if asked, would have voted to keep the name as it was.

What do the rest of you think?

Talking about place names, another one comes to mind.

Everyone in Lisburn knows Chapel Hill. It's always been Chapel Hill and the reason is obvious.

Some years ago the place name was changed to Carson's Hill. Just imagine.

Thankfully, after a short time, the Chapel Hill sign was restored to its rightful place.

Where do these people come from?

Now that I'm on the rostrum, I'll continue about place names.

In my limited knowledge about these things, I would imagine that place names should have some resemblance to their surroundings. "Primrose Hill", "Rose Lane"; even "Squeeze Gut Entry" gives an idea of what to expect from the name. Not ny more it seems.

Nowadays, the name means relatively little. No disrespect mean't, but some of the newer developments here would indicate an English village rather than where we really are. I cannot understand what the thinking is behind this.

Are the planners' imaginations so limited that they just grab the easiest rather than the most appropriate place name.

It's so boring looking at all these new developments with similar sounding names.

"Kenilworth", "Highbury", "Thaxton", "Chatsworth", "Belmont", "Ascot" and so on.

To me, in the first instance, they're dull. Added that that is the fact that they represent nothing.

We do have Housing Developments with names like Carson Court, Molyneaux Drive, Prince William Road and suchlike. Not the most inspiring but you can at least see the history behind them.

Am I getting on my high horse about nothing?

"A rose by any other name would smell as sweet". Would it really? Bring back the descriptive names I say. But then, who am I?

in chapel hill area, mill view and fairymount square have long gone also

When I was walking up Chapel Hill I noticed a sign / map indicating "you are here". On the map it detailed the Fairy mount. I could not figure out where is was; and I had never heard of it before. Barney's post reminded me of this. Anyone know the history of the actual fairy mount?

Ann & Barney,

Sorry to hear that Lisburn is getting beyond our knowing. The old town we were born & reared in is changing rapidly & the familiar names & places are being updated to suit new residents.

They don't remember our town as the family home, as a village, they don't recall the stories & happenings that occured over a lifetime, they did'nt grow with the town, they have'nt the memories, the sorrows, the old friends & foes we have, the laughter, the tears, the love of home.

Lisburn names will not change for us, Piper Hill, Fairymount Square, Chapel Hill, or anywhere else, will always be the names we use, the old names that bring back bittersweet times to every exile.

People will only change names, they can't change us, we ARE Lisburn. When the last of us go, Lisburn will be a new place for strangers.

Pat

Pat, I may well be wrong, but I think Piper's Hill was a nickname, as it were. Market Lane was on a small plaque, high top right looking down toward Barnsley's Row, when I was a child.

Dabbler, I think you are correct . The official name is Market Lane. I must say that when I lived in Barnsleys Row I never heard any of the locals ever calling it Market Lane, it was always Pipers Hill. Technically wrong Ann ,but locally correct. Aidan.

That.s right, Aidan. It would have been like calling Old Mother Riley Arthur Lucan.

I was not aware that Piper's Hill was actually Market Lane. Never once, in my entire lifetime in Lisburn, was the area ever referred to as anything other than Piper's Hill, even by the residents.

I remembered later a couple of descriptive,recent place names given to new housing.

One development is called Linen Green. No explanation there, linen being one of Lisburn's most famous products.

The other is a block of apartments on North Circular Road. The cathedral can been seen from them and their place name is, fittingly, Cathedral View.

All may not yet be lost.

Hildenboy, Fairymount Square no longer exists. Not being a Longstoner, I don't know an awful lot about that end of town. However, I remember putting a posting on about Fairymount Square some months ago. I think I had heard something on the radio about how the name came about, but cannot remember the story accurately now. I'll try and find out for you, seeing you have given us so much pleasure recently in reading your very interesting inputs.

I'm not sure but I think the place is now a car park. I may be wrong, though. Barney or someone from that end of town should know.

Talking about Chapel Hill and Longstone, I'm surprised that more people from that area have not visited the Forum and given us their memories. Surely we Low Roaders and Hilden people are not the only ones that led a life worth writing down.

Beano, I know the Co Down is represented too, but we are still the winners.

Ann

No. I meant the actual Fairy Mount. On the map on the corner of chapel hill it is marked as a place of interest but I could not find it; but I did stand in the middle of that car park.

Dabbler

Glad to see you posting. As always the voice of reason.

Hildenboy, you were so close when you stood in the car park. Google maps will help. Look up St Patricks Church and old graveyard. The fairy mount can be seen at the back of the cemetery . Aidan.

Ann, I am from the Longstone but the last time I suggested that there was too much talk about Hilden and the Low Road I got told off. I know I left at an early age but was often home on leave untill I transferred to the Royal Australian Navy. Of course the guy who started this forum was also from the Longstone or Tonagh Park to be more accurate though his father had a grocery store on the Longstone and then of course a restaurant and take out Fish & Chipes.
My childhood memories of the Longstone are of army convoys especially the American Army during World War 2 the concrete and iron barrier put up during the war to stop any invading army (what a joke). NOw when I see picture of the street on the internet I don't recognize the place as it seems that all the old houses have been turned into shops.
I lived in Lismara Terrace untill I left to go in the Navy but after my family went out to Australia in 1949 I never had a permanent home in Lisburn again though during my Merchant Navy days when I was back a couple of times a year I stayed with an Aunt who had returned from Australia and had been lucky enough to buy another house in Lismara Terrace. Mauri

Aidan, I like reading the comments. I just HAVE to stick my nose in when I see posts about anything so familiar. I spent many hours in my aunt Mary's wee place in Piper's Hill. As an inquisitive urchin, I quickly spotted the name up on the wall. I believe it was white letters on a black background.That name was a wee bit of learning I managed alone. Teachers never talked about a headless piper

Aidan, I must view the fairy mound this week. It's wonderful what we still don't know about, considering having lived here for 72 years. Did I say 72 - I meant 52!!!!!!!!!!

Hildenboy the Fairy Mount was in the grounds of the Manor House which was owned by Lady Stanus. The house was later a childrens home and when this closed homes for the elderly were built there but they were not allowed to build on the Fairy Mount. If you go up Manor Drive to these new homes you may get a better view of it and I am sure some of the residents would be able to tell you more about it. I worked in the childrens home and we use to have a donkey in that field and sometimes the children would play on it. Hope this helps.

Ann, I will have a look myself next weekend. We are invited to a wedding in Lisburn . Time to catch up with family , friends and fairy mounts. Aidan.

Dabbler, Market Lane aka Pipers Hill was a strange place to a young lad. Stories of haunted houses and ghosts. I was told once that the upstairs rooms were the hiding places of the ghosts, so the council demolished the upper floors. Nothing whatsoever to do with the fact they were falling to pieces. Often wondered in later years where the residents went to the toilet as the houses backed on to Barnsleys Row and did'nt have a back yard. I'm not sure about the opposite terrace on the Coulson's factory side. Aidan.

Linda, Aiden, Ann

Thanks for the info. if you visit you must post what you find.

Mauri

Nothing wrong with Longstone Street. My father was born and bred there; my great grandmother lived out her life there. I also lived on the Tonagh Estate for a while and often had a bag of chips from the Niagara.

Aidan,
I was brought up in Pipers hill during the war, fourth house on the left looking up the hill.
I can describe it like I was still there. You went in by the front door, there was no back door. the hall was narrow, on the right was the living room,kitchen,dining room, coalhouse all in one, about ten feet square.
in one corner was the sink with cold water tap, no hot water.
In the opposite corner was the fireplace all heating, cooking and baking was done here.There was no electric or gas except a gas light.
There was a small bedroom with no light or window.Up the stairs was a toilet with no light or window, no washbasin or bath.One bedroom with gaslight and coalfire.
The ghost story is right I was scared to death to go to the toilet. Today it would be called a hovel, but we survived, i'll be 78 in a few weeks and have rarely ailed.
Happy days Leo.

Compared to Lock View Lisnatrunk Pipers Hill was a luxury, there we had neither a sink, running water, flush toilet, gas or electric. I was born there in 1944 and after our mother,s death in 1949 we moved to live with our grandparents in Mill St. Hilden
donald

Leo for the life of me I can not remember houses on the left coming up the hill I still recollect the factory at the bottom on the left and the houses on the right were the sweep lived as a son was in a couple of classes above me at the Boys School , how many houses would have been there ?you say there was no back door so obviously there was no garden looking back it's hard to believe conditions were so basic in our lifetime and we have moved on, Regards Ted

shocked at the heading, pipers hill is no more.? on my recent visit we had about three dinners with my brother and his wife in a restaurant called Angelos in pipers hill, it was very nice and happy memories. i've been there on previous visits.So glad it remained, may return again, glad it's only a play on a place name.

Ted,
There were 7 houses on the left side looking up, plus a barber shop, a bootmenders shop and Maneries storeroom.on the other side I think there was 8 houses and Greers storeroom.
There were two sweeps one on each side,Hugh and Robert Phillips, both had the same nickname which I'll not be allowed to print.
Leo.

Leo ,Thanks I just cant remember the left side its like a memory blank and I often used it as I use to knock about with Gerry Murry from Hill St , Meniere's no problem and now the barbers is coming into focus, and of course I am aware of the name in question from the opposite side of the street, maybe the rest will come back to me in due course, Regards Ted

I can confirm that the proper name for Pipers Hill was Market Lane and such name sign was high up on the wall at the Market Square entrance and was there for many years. I wish I had a dollar for everytime I rode my Post Office bike during the war down that way and the reverse, and yes there were a few houses on the left coming up the hill. Mauri

pipers hill now has 2 street names ,
Market Lane and The Pipers Hill both name plates are displayed at the top and bottom of the hill.it can probaly be called either

TR

I'm not in Lisburn much these days but its always depressing to drive past thaxton etc -who on eath thinks these are appropriate names.And Pipers Hill will always be Pipers Hill!

Allen, I spoke about this exact thing re place names a while ago. As you say, Pipers Hill will always be Pipers Hill to the locals.