Fudcos, Ginesis and Rossis, all contributed much to the Lisburn of my childhood. Rossi's ice cream was as good as Kitty Malloy's. There can be no greater praise. Fusco and Genesi had an equal amount of admirers who would have said their fish suppers were the best in town. It is doubtful that any of them would remember me, but, as an observant youngster, I remember several of them very well. Someone has written here that Fusco's shop was opposite Elmore's fish shop. I do not recall either of the Fusco shops being there. One was on the corner of Bow Street and Graham's Gardens, and the other in the Market Square, between Bridge street and Castle Street, facing the Assembly Rooms. There was a pub there, too. I OUGHT to know the name, but the old brain is full of colleywobbles - whatever they are. That word was one of wee Maggie's. I knew what she meant, but I didn't know what she was talking about. Much like herself, God rest her soul.
I'm up and about late tonight, because the grandchildren are visiting. The wee girl was sitting playing a gane with me on a PS3 one minute, and off to bed the next. Worn out, she was. We were up on the football field earlier, with the okedr brother, and she che chased me round in a game of 'it.
Where was I? Oh, yes, the Italian connection. I remember the Ginesis most of all. I DO remember Dominic Fusco, but not as well as I remember Dominic Ginesi. Tommy Lewis often got a fish supper 'on tick', courtesy of Frankie or Joe, and quite likely Dominic too, when he was old enough.
I'm going to give your heads a rest now. Goodnight.
Boyd - join Barney in the jokes. Leave me to worry about world problems.

Dabbler
The "bottom" Fuscos was on the corner of Graham Gardens, facing J.C.Pattersons which was beside the "big" Elmores. Funny but that was how we differentiated between shops then
donald

Donald; you're dead-on.

Hi Dabbler there was also Louis Forte who
was into greyhounds as well as fish and chip shops,he lived in Balmoral a big house there just backing onto the Balmoral halt ot station and you could see the greyhound pups in the pens when on the train

Barney
I do not remember Forte. My da - none of my Lisburn family will remember this - used to go regularly to Dunmore Park. Greyhounds. Though I personally, was never there. I just remember.
(I googled Dunmore Park after writing, in case it was dementia. Sad. Sweet sadness, as I know my old da definitely enjoyed many times there.)

Hi Dabbler, One Italian, youve forgotten about was Alberto Lecassi, who took over the fish and chip shop , from Billy Lilley, in bridge st in the 1950's
his son Silvano, as i remember was quite popular with the girls at that time, so much so that they had no time for the local lads, They the girls, were around him like bees around a honey pot.

Gerald
I very seldom used Lillys. Chips far too greasy. I remember that clearly. Didn't know the Italians who took over; but I'm jealous.

I remember Lilleys and they were greasy

Louis Forte also lived on the hilhall rd

What about "Greasy Lizzie's in Smithfield or Millars in the Low Rd.

Millar's had a wee bell on the red door that went "Ding" as it opened & the bottles of Mirada stacked up on the shelf behind the counter. Talk about Slow, Slow, Slow. - no high blood pressure there except for the customers. We had only the dunking ducks to watch while we waited. The fish was all ordered & the answer was to the ones who did'nt order.. "We just sold the last one." The chips were wrapped in greaseproof paper & newspapers. The vinegar was seeping through making it essential to open the parcel for to steal a few piping hot chips.

Then there were the big operators like the "Niagara" in the Longstone, owned & run by one of our own, a famous man. Guess who.?
Pat

pat
i went in ONCE to millars low road and never again. was only after fish and chips not splitting the atom? what a wait.
tom

I think every one agreed that Genesis were the best chips around in that era,I stand to be corrected....Frank

Do any of the forumers recall the Italians who were prisoners of war at Smithfield market in the late 40's , they played football against local teams,and usually beat them ,stretch the old minds a bit ,I am not the only one to recall this....Frank

Frank
I,m no expert in war history but am almost sure that Italy changed sides and fought on the side of the allies in the "second half" of the war. I do remember in Hillhall beside Orr,s Lane where Hillhall Primary school was later built concrete bases of Nissan huts which were supposedly remnants of a German POW camp.
donald

On 10 July 1943, a combined force of American and British Commonwealth troops invaded Sicily in Operation Husky. German generals again took the lead in the defence and, although they lost the island after weeks of bitter fights, they succeeded in ferrying large numbers of German and Italian forces safely off Sicily to the Italian mainland. On 19 July, an Allied air raid on Rome destroyed both military and collateral civil installations. With these two events, popular support for the war diminished in Italy.

On 25 July, the Grand Council of Fascism ousted Italian dictator Benito Mussolini and a new Italian government, led by General Pietro Badoglio and King Victor Emmanuel III, took over in Italy. The new Italian government immediately began secret negotiations with the Allies to end the fighting and to come over to the Allied side. On 3 September, a secret armistice was signed with the Allies at Fairfield Camp in Sicily. The armistice was announced on 8 September. By then, the Allies were on the Italian mainland.

On 3 September, British troops crossed the short distance from Sicily to the 'toe' of Italy in Operation Baytown. Two more Allied landings took place on 9 September at Salerno (Operation Avalanche) and at Taranto (Operation Slapstick). The Italian surrender meant that the Allied landings at Taranto took place unopposed, with the troops simply disembarking from warships at the docks rather than assaulting the coastline.

German troops, once they had discovered that the Italians had signed an armistice, moved quickly to disarm the Italian forces and to take over critical defensive positions (Operation Achse). These included Italian-occupied south-eastern France and the Italian-controlled areas in the Balkans. Only in Sardinia, Corse and in part of Apulia and Calabria italian troops were able to hold their positions until the arrival of allied forces. In the area of Rome only one infantry division, Granatieri di Sardegna, and some small armoured units fought with commitment but by September 11 they were overwhelmed by superior german forces.

As Donald's piece here shows, you can learn a lot via the internet. I didn't know any of that; nor did I know about the football matches; but, as I wrote here several times, I Do know there were prisoners behind that big wall facing the Wee Hall in Linenhall Street, when I was five or six or seven.
As Maurice Chevalier said in Gigi,"Ah, yes, I remember it well".

Frank. Dappler, I remember German POWs unloading coal in the railway yard of the Antrim Road and also loadiing army coal trucks in a yard off Quay steet, I can't remember any eyties (Italians). We used to try and trade cigarettes for German army or Luftwaffe badges. I had a couple with the swastika symbol on them untill my aunt found them and threw them in the fire. I guess it was because my uncle had been killed in the Bismarck action a couple of years previous. I do not remember any POWs in the markets and I was round there often enough on my Post Office bike,maybe my old workmate Brendan does.? I also ran into a working party of German POWs once in Drumbo but when I tried to approach them again to try and trade,the British Army guards chased me off. Mauri

i remember millars in grand st if only for the quote"sorry no fish"can anyone remember the paintings in whitcrofts chemist in castle st. i think one of them was a painting of alice morgans house on the corner of barnsleys row.i wonder what happened to them.i don t think whitcrofts chemist is still there, may be wrong. aidso.

I remember here reading some time ago about " spit in the pan " but never knew what it meant, can anyone here help?
My memories of Millers chip shop are the son in law Duncan? who was manager there, he lived in Lawnbrook Drive, worked in Governor Foundry Belfast as a lorry driver.He was an ardent Lambeg drummer around the " Twelfth "
donald

No-one has ever replied that there were prisoners behind that big wall, so maybe I was told that by grownups. But I DO have a memory of a man handing me money through big metal gates at the Smithfield end of Linenhall Street. The gates were locked, and I think I ran an errand for him.Fags, sweets?

I remember German POWs there they used to show us photos of thier families and in thier uniforms

Dabbler,that big wall sheltered the Corn Market,I know it was an Army Service Corps depot during the war,A soldier from there Tom Bridge from Dudley,a motor mechanic, married a relative of mine Bridie Mc Bain they went to England after the war and lived in Cradley Heath Staffordshire.I visited them there in 1992,but they have now passed on.....Frank

Aidso, Whitcrofts Chemist closed down years ago, unfortunately.

Mr Whitcroft was a great wee man as well as a family pharmacist. When my 4 children were young I was in Whitcrofts every week I'm sure. Mr Whitcroft always remembered what cough mixture or tonic I had been using previously and would ask, "Has the child improved"? or "Is the child better now". He was a very genuine person and we young mothers relied on his knowledge a lot. He took time to discuss any minor medical problems we were worried about and gave advice readily.

It was not unknown for him to deliver a box of pills or medicine on his bicycle if they were out of stock when people called. Sometimes this would be after 6 pm.

He never forgot to ask about Dominic or my mother when I was in the shop.

I suppose Mr Whitcroft is no longer with us but I'm sure he's in heaven.

I remember Whitcrofts with great affection and nostalgia .

Frank, I really think the best fish and chips came from Montgomerys.

Ginesi's would have been a close second.

That's my opnion anyhow.

Hello, Jim, you may remember me telling you in an earlier posting that we Low Road people didn't venture as far as the Longstone for our chips. However, the Niagara may well have been every bit as good - I don't know. Maybe some Longstoners could give us an idea.

My memories of Millers chip shop are the son in law Duncan? who was manager there, he lived in Lawnbrook Drive, worked in Governor Foundry Belfast as a lorry driver.He was an ardent Lambeg drummer around the " Twelfth "
donald[/quote]


Donald,

Yes Donald, Duncan the son-in-law, a B-Special, often came in to the chip shop in his uniform, gun & all. No wonder there was no "carry-on" in Millars.

Barney and Frank
Thank you both for info about the secrets of the depot behind that big wall. I remember it in bits. That is, I remember the story of doing the 'messages', and then I remember it years later, when it appears in my mind as something approaching a Corn Market.
Joe

Talking about German prisoners, I remember my Father calling in to our house in East Down View with a German prisoner on his way either to or from Waringstown.

Later he gave me a present of a ship-in-a-bottle made by a German prisoner. It was made from a large sauce bottle & pieces of wood, bits of pebbles, plaster & paint. A quay scene of little houses with red roofs & a lighthouse, alongside which is a flat boat, with sails, in the water.

I still have it here with me & I marvel at the skill needed to make this out of practically nothing, while in prison. Unfortunately the sails are gone, with us fiddling with them when the matchstick holding them up collapsed & we tried to fix it with no luck.

There were other mementos in our house, in Lisburn, of decorated cigarette cases made from Mess tins. Very skilful boys those Germans.

Pat

Memories, Memories.....

Mr.Whitcroft, a lovely wee man. When my second son was 18 we bought, as a birthday present for him, Mrs. Whitcroft's Morris Minor, a little green car with 4 doors, in perfect condition, from Mr. Whitcroft.

Joe drove it from Lisburn to Limerick, where we lived then & a year later, when we moved to Dublin, he sold it to a dealer on the Dublin Rd. Limerick as he bought another car.

A sale we regret, as the Morris Minor became a valuable item of vintage later & we wonder who was lucky enough to purchase our one, which we should have had remodelled & kept, even tho' we had no room for it in the drive of the new house, the only reason we did sell it at the time.

I am sure it is still driving at vintage show as it was a great little car.


Pat

Pat
Are you not confusing Waringstown with Waringsfield outside Moira? There was a military hospital there up until the 60s. Now it is an housing estate and a senior citizens residence.
donald

Donald,


You are right as usual, was'nt sure if it was Waringsfield or Waringstown. Senior moment. Not surprisig these days.

Pat

I remember on a Sunday afternoon my mother taking me to visit my father in Waringsfield Hospital where he spent some time.

I always remember the signature tune for the programme "Down your Way" playing on the radio as we either entered or left the hospital. Funny how melodies stay in your head and remind you of where you were on certain occasions. That particular tune will always remind me of Waringsfield Hospital.

"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""
yer givin yer age away here Ann

One signature tune I remember often & like is the one played for Desert island Discs "Sleepy Lagoon"

" A tropical moon, a sleepy lagoon & you"


Pat