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Aloha Warwick Ford,
I watched the antiangiogenisis video. I am bothered by the last statements by Li about eating tomatoes. Especially when the PLCO indicated that eating tomatoes does not protect you from PCa. From my own personal experience, I've been eating tomatoes as long as I can remember, not in abundance, but at least one/day for the past 10 years. I still got cancer.
I understand that we are all different, and we are affected in different ways by the foods we eat. I realize that there are no studies in that I ate what they ate (did not happen), but every person must make there own decision about what they eat.
I just do not see any progress about this subject and am not willing to give up my food pleasures just because "IT MIGHT CURE CANCER", which to date, it has not.
Last month, I received a grant to attend the Kokolulu Farm and Cancer Retreat Center here on the Big Island. It is a 3-4 day workshop to gain tools needed to cope with cancer treatment. One of these tools is what you eat. I know that they do NOT serve red meat. I also know that I have serious problems eating fruits and so need sources of energy. So, ... we shall continue to try things outside my box.
Hamakua Coast, love it, even with a poor quality of life,
When I found out my PSA was rising I read as much as I could about Prostate Cancer and what I could do to help myself against it. The first thing I found was I should change my diet so of course I did.
Then I read study after study that said the food I was told would help me really didn't. So I ended up thinking some foods are good for you, and do have properties that help overall health, but there doesn't seem to be a silver bullet so I quit worrying about food and started eating what I wanted to. I have improved my diet and will continue to moderate what I eat, but I don't deny myself the foods I love. I just moderate it now.
What I ended up thinking is this. If you took 1 Thousand people and gave them the same diet and environment and followed them for 10 years I bet their outcomes would be significantly different. Simply because each persons makeup is different and they react differently. So maybe all medical studies are flawed because of that very fact. So my thoughts about medical studies have changed.
To put it another way. If you took 1 Thousand people with Gleason 7 PCa and followed them, with the same diet and environment, would their outcomes be the same, or vary widely. I think their outcomes would vary widely because each person is different.
Every time I see your name, I read your posts to see where you are on this journey.
I think that it is possible that if we believe what we are doing will help us to recover from cancer, our bodies will respond toward a better self. I think this because it is clear to me that when we enter that portal called depression, unless we get intervention help, the body does go down hill. This is a some what scary position to be in. You are afraid of where you are, and if you don't change your thinking, it will get worse. Cancer pushes one toward this portal. Somehow we must receive positive feed back to overcome our fears and return to the road of recovery. I've tried to sleep it off when things get bad. I've tried to work harder here on the farm. What seems to help the most are the correct words and support from care givers, your close friends and when the medical community finally gets it right.
I hope your mind is headed in the right direction. I hope your body will follow, no mater what you eat.
Hang in there,
I know you have had a tremendous battle with the black dog of depression. Have you ever tried meditation? I was fortunate to be introduced to meditation very early on in my journey at a small Buddhist temple. It was amazing how much beter I felt. I used the technique for many months on a regular basis until I had everything under control (as much as we are ever in control!!), but still use it if the pressures start building.
I think the key is to recognise the signs of whatever it is that starts pushing us toward the slipper slope downwards and start fighting them before they get too powerful. I remember talking to an old pilot when I used to take trips around Africa in light aircraft. He was watching some large cumulo-nimbus clouds building and remarked that we might not be able to take off for a while. I joked that with his experience he should be able to handle a few clouds. His response was that there were old pilots and there were bold pilots, but no old, bold pilots - and that avoidance was a far better option than trying to battle the forces in a large cloud!!
Very well said, Terry. I have also struggled mightily with that black dog; it very nearly caused my demise 20 years ago. I have never been an advocate of organized religion, never been introduced to anything like Buddhist meditation; but was helped back to my feet by a wise counselor (forced upon me by an equally wise employer) who taught me that I simply could not continue to hide my depression and suppress my feelings; I had to confront them.
At my diagnosis of PCa I started feeling myself slipping; but as I have previously stated, finding this and other sites that pulled me out of my self-imposed lonely isolation, taught me what others had faced, and gave me options moving forward, has been a tremendous help and empowered me to confidently make decisions.
I think it is important to distinguish between an organised religion and my reference to meditation in a Buddhist temple. There was no requirement to 'join' the religion, to change any beliefs, to do anything except attend the classes where a wise old woman taught us how to go into another place, to calm ourselves down, to use our own resources more efficiently. No pressure anywhere, just a wonderful calmness.
I dare say I could have been given the same tuition in what might be termed a 'secular' environment.
I fully understood, Terry. I actually meant to convey that I wished I HAD been introduced to meditation as were you, but was lucky enough to find another path to learning how we can "use our own resources".
Thank you, I had not heard that exact rendition of "old bold". Ya, things are not going so well right now. I spent most of last week trying to identify the doc managing my pain management ... could not ... my regular PCP is on vacation and when she returns next week, she will accept that duty without hesitation, but her replacement is in a different world. I also though I had this nausea/pain cycle figured out, but the only anti-nausea I could find with out sugar filler (hard on sinuses) was in a suppository. After a week of using, it has become painful also and is usually expelled with in an hour. I would rather put up with the pain than face the debilitating nausea. Yesterday, the urge came on so fast I barely had time to stand up before I filled up my pants. The irritation is, I'm sure from the damage to the colon, rectum, & anus from EBRT, 2.5 years ago.
Yes, thank you I have been daily meditating since Oct 08. I did quit therapy in May 09 because I could see no progress. I have since Feb started to use BHS again, but they have their own problems and I've only had five sessions. They are overworked and under staffed. Have written two letters of concern to my HMO, so far do not know if anything will come of it. I'm going to stick it out this time.
Other posts have explained why this pain occurs. I don't understand why the uro doc has not seen the pattern, two times, different anti-biotic's, pain/blood goes away during treatment, then returns about a week after stopping treatment. Something that is not being seen by the cultures. This last sample, gave yesterday, had blood clots, dark cloudy, what is going on? Find out and this pain should go away. At first I thought it was radiation damage. Probably a compound problem. Difficult to get any work done around here.
Thanks for your concern and comment, Someone does read this drivel,
Gidday Joe, here is a short transcript from William Li
"What is the evidence in people that eating certain foods can REDUCE angiogenesis in cancer? Well, the best example I know is a study of 79,000 men, followed over 20 years, in which it was found that men whom consumed cooked tomatoes two to three times a week had up to a 50 percent reduction in their RISK of developing prostate cancer."
My understanding of diet is that it will NOT cure an existing cancer, for me, diet is a "self care" preventitive measure AFTER treatment.
Here is a quote from Assoc Prof Prem Rashid in his book "Prostate Cancer" page 18.
"Dietry issues relate to long term risk more than what happens after a cancer is diagnosed. Some men feel the need to alter their diet after the diagnosis but there is no evidence that it affects their prostate cancer"
"Lycopene, the red pigment in tomatoe, is a powerful carotenoid. It is a strong antioxidant and has been found to lower the risk of cancer"...page 22 he then cites three studies that supports this position.
From Prof Richard Beliveau's book, "Foods that fight Cancer"
"Tomatoes, the prostates best friend, should be seen as a food that belongs to an overall strategy of cancer prevention through diet"...page 156, he then cites 3 further studies to support this position.
So all in all I also ate tomatoes regularly, and brussels sprouts, broccoli etc yet wound up in the "barb wire canoe without a paddle" Yup I have altered my diet and I can say for the better it wasn't what I stopped eating but rather what I began to eat, like a glass of red wine in the evenings, dark chocolate, asian, indian, italian, raspberries, blueberries, cranberries, etc etc etc, my family thinks it's like eating at a resaurant most nights.
I just want to live, restore my health and do whatever it takes to keep cancer at bay for as long as I can for my family.