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Division One Title Race (& Relegation Possibilities)

I am not sure whether this link will work, but it should show the Division One Results & Remaining Fixtures Grid from Full-Time...while the current Division One Table can be found here.
The only Division One fixture currently arranged is between ourselves and Rosemill this coming Sunday. All remaining fixtures are yet to be announced.

Enfield Crusaders have one match left, but that is at Home to Larsens, who can win the title themselves (on goal difference) if they win all three of their remaining matches. Their other two opponents are FC Alpha...and ourselves !
I think we have to assume that Asco 'non-fulfilled' against FC Alpha yesterday...I wish the League would tell us instead of just putting 'null-null/Result Pending' on Full-Time as it is leaving the rest of us completely in the dark ! That would mean three more points being awarded to FC Alpha at the League Management Committee Meeting this coming Thursday night, and Alpha would then win the title themselves if they beat Rosemill (which they should do) and also beat Larsens, and if Larsens beat Enfield Crusaders. (Enfield Crusaders only need a draw against Larsens to win the title).

As for relegation (i.e. finishing 9th, as only the bottom club will go down due to FC Rosemill dropping out at the start of the season), that is only between ourselves and Asco. Nobody else is anywhere near close to going down.
Asco are three points behind us and assuming their match against FC Alpha was a non-fulfilment by them, that leaves them with two games left to play...against Turnford Geese and Rosemill. The Turnford Geese match was originally arranged for this coming Sunday (7th April), but has now been wiped off the Fixture list with neither team playing at all ! The League are denying that it is another non-fulfilment by Asco and that they have folded, but another rumour going round yesterday was that Turnford Geese have actually 'non-fulfilled' that match, meaning Asco would get the points (this Thursday ?) to put them level with us !
However, I suspect it is more likely that the League have just agreed to re-arrange the fixture to another date because there are still plenty of Sundays left for those two teams to play the match. Again though, the rest of the clubs in the Division (including ourselves) are all just having to guess !

So...here's what I think will be the most likely scenario...
FC Alpha will beat Rosemill and get the points against Asco, then they will lose to Larsens, who will make sure all their top Semi-Pros are playing. Larsens will also do likewise against Enfield Crusaders and beat them as well.
Meanwhile, Asco play Turnford Geese (on the 14th April) and lose to them narrowly, but then to stitch us up (thanks to Cascoe's sending-off against them in that first match of the season), Rosemill deliberately piss about and let Asco beat them by a big margin, so that Asco are level with us on points but now only 10 goals behind instead of the current 25 because we have lost heavily to both Rosemill and Turnford Geese through players dropping out on the morning of the match.
We then play Away to Larsens on Sunday 5th May in the last Division One match of the season. Larsens need to win 11-0 to win the title on goal difference and we need to lose 11-0 to finish bottom (below Asco) on goal difference.
We then turn up with just a bare eleven including no goalkeeper but (thankfully) not including me. We then lose by a 'cricket score' of anything between 11-0 and 29-0 (the latter equalling our club record defeat ) while I am filming the match as usual. Larsens players then all cavort about in front of the camera taking the piss and our players really couldn't give a sh!t.

Yes, it has happened before. Brimsdown Rovers did it (a 10-0 win ?) when we got relegated from the Premier Division 9 years ago and Flamstead End are another who have 'ran up to the camera' on beating us to win a title, although not quite as extreme.

A message to our players then...please don't do this to me again !!!

Re: Division One Title Race (& Relegation Possibilities)

Here's an update on this...

Asco did indeed non-fulfil against FC Alpha, so they now have two matches left (against Turnford Geese and Rosemill), both of whom they are capable of beating if they get a full-strength side out (to therefore finish above us if we lose our two remaining matches). Turnford Geese did not non-fulfil against Asco. That game is now taking place this coming Sunday. If Turnford Geese win that, then Asco will definitely finish bottom.

I am still waiting for the Minutes from Thursday night's League Management Committee meeting to arrive in my inbox. In those minutes, it should give an indication as to what teams may be joining the League from other Leagues next season, and also some sort of guideline or proposed constitution as to relegation and promotion between the divisions for next season.
In the LMC meeting minutes for the previous month, it said New Riverside, the top team in the East Herts Corinthian Sunday League have applied to join our League next season. When Cuffley did that two seasons ago, the League put them straight in Division One, so I would expect them to do likewise with New Riverside, as they will be too strong for Division Two.
Assuming they will be putting 10 teams in each division again instead of scrapping a division and putting 11 or 12 teams in each, that should mean that we are 'already' relegated to Division Two whatever we do now in our two remaining matches, unless a team from the Premier Division or from above us in Division One fold up. As we have only won one game all season, I don't think we can really argue if they put us down, even though our results against the top sides have invariably been close (up until lately).

As for the Larsens match, if they win their League Senior Cup Semi-Final against Upshire this coming Sunday, then we will probably be playing them in midweek. The Final is on Sunday 21st April and the 28th April and the 5th May will be saved for them to play FC Alpha and Enfield Crusaders. The League will not arrange a game between two teams going for the title in midweek, so we would therefore have to play Larsens in midweek instead. It would probably be on a Wednesday night on either the 17th or 24th April or the 1st May, but at Town Mead in Waltham Abbey with a 6.15.p.m. Kick-Off.
I think we are probably going to have to hope that Larsens lose to Upshire to save us from a non-fulfilment.

Re: Division One Title Race (& Relegation Possibilities)

News from the League Meeting last night...

Asco have now finally dropped out and their last two matches (including this Sunday's game against Turnford Geese) will be written off as points awarded to their opponents. That means we will not be finishing bottom.
However, we are being relegated to Division Two anyway because basically we are not good enough for Division One (only one win all season) and there are teams coming into the League from other Leagues who are better than us and will be put straight into Division One. That's despite Mardan also apparently folding up (because nobody wants to be their Secretary/Manager). I don't know who these new teams are yet. That won't be announced until the League AGM in mid-May.

Dynamo Cross have also folded and it is expected that some other teams will also fold before next season starts. If that happens, the League will be looking at scrapping a division and having 11 or 12 teams in each division instead of the 9 we had in Division One last season. They will take a gamble that the weather won't be as bad next season and cause another backlog of fixtures. We would still be put in Division Two though, which would then be the third division down of four. I would guess they would then scrap the League Intermediate Cup, so that Premier & Division One teams go in the League Senior Cup and Division Two & Three teams go in the League Junior Cup...which would include us.

I know that one or two of our players (including Hagan ?) said they would leave if we got relegated (because they feel we don't deserve to be), and the League have said that we can ask to stay up if we want to and they will 'see what they can do'. However, I agree with Trev. I think we should go down.
As Terry Moore rightly said after one of our recent heavy defeats...'Too many of our players don't know how to play football'.
Unlike other clubs in Division One, we are not going to get a load of ex-Semi-Pros joining us because we do not have the contacts to bring them in.
We will get new players as we always do, but they will be more of the Powerleague/kickabout over the park/work team Friendly matches variety. They need to learn how to play 11-a-side tactically and competitively at a lower level, otherwise we are just going to end up in a relegation dogfight once again.

We have to inform the League by Monday if we want to stay in Division One, so please let me know your thoughts if you have any. I'm sure Hagan & Barney will, but I doubt if anybody else will be that bothered to be honest...hence me not complaining last night.

Re: Division One Title Race (& Relegation Possibilities)

I don't want to drop down to that level.

Re: Division One Title Race (& Relegation Possibilities)

In an ideal world, I'd rather not drop down, I'd prefer to improve the squad, stay at this level and be more competitive next season. Personally, I want to play the highest level possible, whilst I can (I appreciate I'm no spring chicken).

Having said that, if we were aren't presented with an alternative other than to drop down, then I think we just deal with it, and make our aim to get promoted back next season.

Barney

Re: Division One Title Race (& Relegation Possibilities)

Myself and Hagan have just had a text conversation regarding trying to get ex-Semi-Pro standard players to join us so that we can stay in this division and compete for something instead of struggling to stay in it year after year.

Hagan says that players he knows who are of that standard won't join us simply because of our results, irrespective of the fact that we are probably the best-run club in the League and play on the best pitch in the League. I agree 100% with him. We have always had that problem. Players want to play for a winning team more than anything else.
The players we have got at the moment are all good enough technically and ability-wise, but we need more who have played either Semi-Pro on Saturdays, at Premier Division level in our League (like Riaz for example), or were coached to play 11-a-side properly as youngsters, invariably at a Pro Club's Academy (like Hagan was at Leyton Orient). Every other team in the top two divisions have plenty of those players, but we do not.
We also need a tall, young Semi-Pro standard goalkeeper of course.

Somehow we need to convince at least 4 or 5 of those sort of players to join all at the same time...and pretty much now before the 7-a-side League starts. John (Scouller) tried it at the start of last season though when he brought 4 or 5 Semi-Pros along from work. Not John's fault as it was well worth a try, but they were all unreliable, didn't think they had to pay any subs, and then worked shifts most Sunday mornings.

Re: Division One Title Race (& Relegation Possibilities)

Laurence Hughes
News from the League Meeting last night...

However, I agree with Trev. I think we should go down.


I'm confused. I said that I did not want to go down. I may have said that our current squad is not good enough to win Division One but I enjoy the challenge of competing with these teams and taking points off them due to our good organisation. I would prefer to sign new players and improve the current players so we can challenge.

Re: Division One Title Race (& Relegation Possibilities)

Lol

If you can avoid it you should try to get the team to stay up. Going down a division brings other problems. It will drag current players level down. You will then have the same problem of players going missing.

I don't understand how anyone would want to go down. I remember you and Trev saying on a number of occasions that we have lost by one goal and it was sooooo close.

Whats changed????

Even with 10 players and players missing we have performed well against good teams. So to doubt the quality of the current players is wrong.

I agree with the fact that some players are more 5 a side players and not real 11 a side players who understand match situations and tactics.

I dont see semi pro players playing in a lower division when they didnt play this season.

Also how do you judge the reason of just winning one game? Was it the fact certain players were not given a chance earlier. Should we have been more attacking? Wrong formation?

It might not be fair to just say get in a team of semi pro's. Also you will need to then say to 7 or 8 players sorry but these semi pro players will be ahead of you.

What happens when the semi pro players get pissed off and go missing youll end up getting 8 and 9 . Same situation.

Re: Division One Title Race (& Relegation Possibilities)

Gazza
I don't understand how anyone would want to go down. I remember you and Trev saying on a number of occasions that we have lost by one goal and it was sooooo close.

Whats changed????
The 7-0 defeat to Enfield Crusaders when we fielded a squad of 14 but were outclassed, plus three other recent matches where we have started with only 10 men, probably because we keep losing. That's why I said we should go down...if everybody else thinks it's a good idea.

Gazza
I dont see semi pro players playing in a lower division when they didnt play this season.
They won't be playing in a lower division. What I am saying is that we need them if we want to win something in Division One.

Gazza
Also how do you judge the reason of just winning one game? Was it the fact certain players were not given a chance earlier. Should we have been more attacking? Wrong formation?
It's because other teams in Division One are better than us and their players 'know how to play football' (to use Terry's phrase).
I have just looked at the Shots Counts from all of our matches this season. There have been only two matches in which we have had more shots at goal than our opponents...the 1-1 draw at Home to Asco and the 4-2 Cup win early in the season against White Hart, a struggling Division Four side ! Can you believe that ?!!! . I think that proves we are not good enough and that we have actually been lucky to win that one game against Larsens, draw others and get away with a number of one-goal defeats when we should have lost by more. As Trev rightly says, it is only because of his organisational abilities that we have got away with that. We can't keep on playing like that in Division One forever.

Gazza
It might not be fair to just say get in a team of semi pro's.
It is if they are committed to turning up every week and they pay their subs. If they don't, we get rid of them...like those who John brought along at the start of the season. We then gave others like Tony King, Frankie & Gavin starts ahead of them, so we were being fair. Those three didn't stop playing because we signed up Semi-Pros to play ahead of them.

Trevor
I would prefer to sign new players and improve the current players so we can challenge.
Showing them on a tactics board before the match how to get goalside of the correct players is a must then !

Re: Division One Title Race (& Relegation Possibilities)

According to this, Asco are playing their last two fixtures...so presumably dropping out after that.
If they win them both, then we will finish bottom and get relegated whether we like it or not, unless we beat either Turnford Geese or Larsens.

I suggest those of our players (and Trev) who have come on here saying they don't want to go down phone their team-mates and tell them to turn up and make an effort then !
Also, we would have to forget about giving people a game to reward loyalty. It will be a case of having to field our strongest possible side.

Re: Division One Title Race (& Relegation Possibilities)

We will get points.

Think positive.

Re: Division One Title Race (& Relegation Possibilities)

Here's the latest...

I have e-mailed the League Competitions Secretary (Dave Smith) and told him we want to stay in Division One.
Asco lost 3-2 to Turnford Geese today, so that will help as they now cannot catch us. What a close shave though !

We still need to make an effort in our last two matches and not get thrashed though. Problem is...Larsens beat Upshire today in their League Senior Cup Semi-Final, so that probably means we will now be playing Larsens in midweek, although it won't be this coming Wednesday. It might be on the 24th though.
As far as I know, the dates for our two remaining fixtures will be announced on Saturday afternoon (20th April), so we will have to wait until then to find out.
The scenario in that case (having to play in midweek) could be a non-fulfilment by us which would screw Larsens up for the Division One title as they need goals, not a 0-0 win, while we would also screw ourselves up as it would give the League more ammunition to relegate us if we cannot field a team.

Re: Division One Title Race (& Relegation Possibilities)

Will some of Larsens players be unable to play midweek ?

Re: Division One Title Race (& Relegation Possibilities)

Trevor Hughes
Will some of Larsens players be unable to play midweek ?
No. That's why midweek matches in our League are played on Wednesdays.
Semi-Pro games are played on Tuesday nights and they train on Thursdays.

Re: Division One Title Race (& Relegation Possibilities)

It's now been confirmed here that we are playing Turnford Geese on Sunday 28th April and we are playing Larsens on Wednesday 1st May with a 6.30.p.m. Kick-Off at Larsens Rec.

I am out filming a Cup Final in Chatham tonight, so I'll update the website tomorrow (Friday) and start chasing players up then.